Psyker

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Re: Psyker

Postby Ghost » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:14 am

Is there a reason blue beads are so mucn easier to soak than red? St the moment it seems a no brainer to spec for mental strain as you soak twice as many per skill level....
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Re: Psyker

Postby mindwanders » Wed Jun 24, 2015 7:05 am

Blue beads are resisted with Integrity not leadership and Integrity only gives you one resist. Leadership gives you two rallies per rank, but can only be used on an ally not yourself, so you need a minder to keep you going.

Specced for red beads you still need a minder, but they are not limited in how many times they can heal you per combat. But damage doesn't wear off the way a fear call would.

For drawing a blue bead, are you allowed to use the power before you take the effects of the fear, or is it saved until after the fear ends?
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Re: Psyker

Postby mindwanders » Wed Jun 24, 2015 7:17 am

Also, does damage taken from red beads cause you to need 30 seconds concentration before you can make the call?
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Re: Psyker

Postby Alliandra » Wed Jun 24, 2015 6:26 pm

Whilst I really love the bead changes from a flavour viewpoint I am very, very worried that these are going to result in a lot of dead psykers.

As it is I am going to have to respec myself to have even more integrity and that also means that I will be constantly vulnerable to general fear calls if I use any powers I might get in a fight. Not to mention if I get very unlucky with a draw whilst low on them I will just get gacked due to possession.

This makes me a feel a bit down about playing a Psyker. I don't mind there being a danger, but this ups it to quite a huge degree I feel. Not to mention that the red bead route basically requires someone to stick with you as your personal healer if you want to achieve much in a fight and that doesn't seem particularly fair.
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Re: Psyker

Postby Artemis » Wed Jun 24, 2015 8:27 pm

All the tests I've run don't really play out the way many are fearing. Or at least the amount of stuff that the hypothetical psyker can fling are seriously astonishing so the risk is pretty worth it.

It takes some conscious effort to reach the serious minuses and the main realistic possibility of it that was identified during the development process was if the psyker had seriously gone nuts with using powers without drawing during combat and has to draw a lot at the end of combat.

Can I ask existing psykers to do some mock draws and see at what points they start doing themselves some serious injury.
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Re: Psyker

Postby mindwanders » Wed Jun 24, 2015 11:24 pm

To be honest, it should be way less lethal as there's half as many chances to do yourself damage and they each only do one level of damage instead of two.

With my draw of 7 I once pulled 4 coloured beads. That's me straight from full health to dying in one use of powers under the old system.

Under the new system, as there were two blue and two red cards, I'd have been able to counter the two fear effects with my integrity and found myself on two health. Pretty good for a disastrous draw.

I'll need to find my draw deck and have a play. But, I think I'm now much less likely to end up bleeding on the floor before the enemy gets close.
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Re: Psyker

Postby Ghost » Thu Jun 25, 2015 2:36 am

mindwanders wrote:To be honest, it should be way less lethal as there's half as many chances to do yourself damage and they each only do one level of damage instead of two.


Red Damage is vastly *more* lethal now - not in and of itself, but in that it eats a level of vitality it didn't do before and as such makes you much more vulnerable to attack from other sources. This properly screws over combat psykers - a bad draw for your pool pre combat could negate all of your fortitude.

Having done 5 sets of 3 test draws, using pyro's stats, and the example six bead draws given, I pretty much ended up with between 2 and 3 levels of fortitude lost over the three drawers. For a combat psyker that's a death sentence - not from the powers, but from the other enemies trying to kill me, which seems not to have been considered under this revision.

A better solution IMHO would be that Red did Single VItal and chewed through your body hits - this would leave your vitality intact but still run the same strain track.

Under the current system you are essentially asking psykers to run around with their own personal healer, which seems counter to the heroic ethos of the system.
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Re: Psyker

Postby Maakeff » Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:57 am

Ghost wrote:which seems counter to the heroic ethos of the system.

But is, for better of worse, pretty accurate to source (assuming source is tabletop 40k miniature battles). "Perils of the Warp" is a significant mechanic for psykers, in those games.

Fully appreciate that "true to source" isn't always good for a LARP, of course - but it's another perspective.
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Re: Psyker

Postby Artemis » Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:10 pm

Ghost wrote:
mindwanders wrote:To be honest, it should be way less lethal as there's half as many chances to do yourself damage and they each only do one level of damage instead of two.


Red Damage is vastly *more* lethal now - not in and of itself, but in that it eats a level of vitality it didn't do before and as such makes you much more vulnerable to attack from other sources. This properly screws over combat psykers - a bad draw for your pool pre combat could negate all of your fortitude.

Having done 5 sets of 3 test draws, using pyro's stats, and the example six bead draws given, I pretty much ended up with between 2 and 3 levels of fortitude lost over the three drawers. For a combat psyker that's a death sentence - not from the powers, but from the other enemies trying to kill me, which seems not to have been considered under this revision.

A better solution IMHO would be that Red did Single VItal and chewed through your body hits - this would leave your vitality intact but still run the same strain track.

Under the current system you are essentially asking psykers to run around with their own personal healer, which seems counter to the heroic ethos of the system.


Have you taken into account what you can do with three stacks of six bead draws?
Each one is two FLAME DOUBLE KNOCKDOWN calls and a GLOBAL QUAD KNOCKDOWN
or fifteen vitality chewing DOUBLEs
or five uses of FLAME DOUBLE KNOCKDOWN

So, yeah there's a risk and there's a possibility of losing some of your toughness but the trade off is you get some pretty apocalyptic attack calls. And in the examples I've had you run you've gotten to do any combination of three of the above amongst other combos too, still feeling so bad about being down a couple of hits?
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Re: Psyker

Postby Ghost » Thu Jun 25, 2015 9:31 pm

Artemis wrote:
Ghost wrote:
mindwanders wrote:To be honest, it should be way less lethal as there's half as many chances to do yourself damage and they each only do one level of damage instead of two.


Red Damage is vastly *more* lethal now - not in and of itself, but in that it eats a level of vitality it didn't do before and as such makes you much more vulnerable to attack from other sources. This properly screws over combat psykers - a bad draw for your pool pre combat could negate all of your fortitude.

Having done 5 sets of 3 test draws, using pyro's stats, and the example six bead draws given, I pretty much ended up with between 2 and 3 levels of fortitude lost over the three drawers. For a combat psyker that's a death sentence - not from the powers, but from the other enemies trying to kill me, which seems not to have been considered under this revision.

A better solution IMHO would be that Red did Single VItal and chewed through your body hits - this would leave your vitality intact but still run the same strain track.

Under the current system you are essentially asking psykers to run around with their own personal healer, which seems counter to the heroic ethos of the system.


Have you taken into account what you can do with three stacks of six bead draws?
Each one is two FLAME DOUBLE KNOCKDOWN calls and a GLOBAL QUAD KNOCKDOWN
or fifteen vitality chewing DOUBLEs
or five uses of FLAME DOUBLE KNOCKDOWN

So, yeah there's a risk and there's a possibility of losing some of your toughness but the trade off is you get some pretty apocalyptic attack calls. And in the examples I've had you run you've gotten to do any combination of three of the above amongst other combos too, still feeling so bad about being down a couple of hits?


Knocking off vitality is not just a couple of hits it is potentially three calls of quad.

I would much rather see reds do vital damage and would even think double vital per bead would be more balanced than this current system.
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